Firefox or what?

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Firefox or what?

hw-2
Hi,

does any of the Firefox versions that can be installed with pkg
actually work?  Firefix continues to freeze, crash, being unable to
remember its settings, to not show up at all when starting it other
than in the process list, and it usually can't be killed even with
kill -9.

If Firefox is incompatible with FreeBSD, what's the alternative?
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Re: Firefox or what?

Steve O'Hara-Smith
On Mon, 12 Aug 2019 17:37:54 +0200
hw <[hidden email]> wrote:

> Hi,
>
> does any of the Firefox versions that can be installed with pkg
> actually work?

        Yes I've been using Firefox on FreeBSD for a very long time now,
always installed from packages. Currently I'm running Firefox 68.01 on
FreeBSD 12 with no problems at all.

>  Firefix continues to freeze, crash, being unable to
> remember its settings,

        None of this.

> to not show up at all when starting it other
> than in the process list,

        Not sure what this means, I usually start it from a small script
in .wmx (that's just how my window manager works) that just
runs /usr/local/bin/firefox. Just typing firefox at a command prompt also
works fine.

> and it usually can't be killed even with
> kill -9.

        Never seen that, and my home directory is NFS mounted.

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Re: Firefox or what?

Andrea Venturoli
In reply to this post by hw-2
On 8/12/19 5:37 PM, hw wrote:
> Hi,
>
> does any of the Firefox versions that can be installed with pkg
> actually work?  Firefix continues to freeze, crash, being unable to
> remember its settings, to not show up at all when starting it other
> than in the process list, and it usually can't be killed even with
> kill -9.

I'm using firefox-esr on 11.2/amd64 and I don't have so many problems
(although it sometimes hangs and I've incurred in a couple of bugs).

What FreeBSD version are you using?
Did you read pkg message?
Other details on your system?



> what's the alternative?

Now, that's a good point; so far my dislike of FireFox is constantly
growing, by I failed to find an alternative.
What I tried:

_ Chromium: while I just don't like it in general (and I don't like
FireFox more and more mimicking it), it's the OmniBar which make me
avoid it at all costs;

_ PaleMoon: more or less worked (altough some sites refuse it), but it's
now gone like SeaMonkey;

_ Falkon: seems quite light; unfortunately it hangs much more frequently
than FireFox (I'll try again after the upgrade to 11.3).



If someone comes up with other options I might be glad to try them :)

  bye & Thanks
        av.
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Re: Firefox or what?

tech-lists
In reply to this post by hw-2
On Mon, Aug 12, 2019 at 05:37:54PM +0200, hw wrote:
>Hi,
>
>does any of the Firefox versions that can be installed with pkg
>actually work?  Firefix continues to freeze, crash, being unable to
>remember its settings, to not show up at all when starting it other
>than in the process list, and it usually can't be killed even with
>kill -9.
>
>If Firefox is incompatible with FreeBSD, what's the alternative?

The version I'm using is 68.0.1 and freebsd is 12-stable r350717 and I have no
firefox issues.

I'm using pkg but I build my own packages with poudriere-devel.

Need more information from you regarding the issue before even guessing what
might be wrong. What version of firefox is installed? if installed from
packages, what does pkg info | grep firefox say? What freebsd version?
Anything in /var/log/messages that might indicate a firefox problem? What's
the spec of the machine?

Saying all that, have a look at the last suggestion (dated 2019-08-03 14:48:49
UTC) on this thread it might be useful:
https://bugs.freebsd.org/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=228855#c11 

--
J.

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Re: Firefox or what?

Polytropon
In reply to this post by hw-2
On Mon, 12 Aug 2019 17:37:54 +0200, hw wrote:
> Hi,
>
> does any of the Firefox versions that can be installed with pkg
> actually work?  Firefix continues to freeze, crash, being unable to
> remember its settings, to not show up at all when starting it other
> than in the process list, and it usually can't be killed even with
> kill -9.

I have a FreeBSD 12.0-p7/i386 installation running Firefox 68.0,
and I don't have any problems. I even tried "modern" web pages,
and even though Firefox sometimes seems to run a bit too slow,
no crashes or freezes.

But what you're describing rings a bell.

Just to make sure you're not suffering from an inconsistent
file system, boot your system in single-user mode and perform
a forced full fsck on all filesystems, especially those carrying
/usr/local and /home. Make sure you have the following setting
in /etc/rc.conf:

        background_fsck="NO"

Inconsistent file system can definitely cause the kind of problem
you're seeing, so make sure it's not the case.

NB: Does only apply to UFS. ;-)



> If Firefox is incompatible with FreeBSD, what's the alternative?

It isn't. Things that do not build or run on FreeBSD are either
marked "BROKEN", or aren't part of the ports collection.



--
Polytropon
Magdeburg, Germany
Happy FreeBSD user since 4.0
Andra moi ennepe, Mousa, ...
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Re: Firefox or what?

Evilham
In reply to this post by hw-2
On dl., ag. 12 2019, [hidden email] wrote:

> Hi,
>
> does any of the Firefox versions that can be installed with pkg
> actually work?  Firefix continues to freeze, crash, being unable
> to
> remember its settings, to not show up at all when starting it
> other
> than in the process list, and it usually can't be killed even
> with
> kill -9.
>
> If Firefox is incompatible with FreeBSD, what's the alternative?

Confirming what others said: Firefox works just fine at least in
12-RELEASE and 13-CURRENT.

Cherry on top of the pie: I even managed to recompile it in
poudriere with sndio support (and no alsa / pulseaudio) and even
like that it works beautifully :-).
--
Evilham
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Re: Firefox or what?

hw
In reply to this post by Steve O'Hara-Smith
Steve O'Hara-Smith <[hidden email]> writes:

> On Mon, 12 Aug 2019 17:37:54 +0200
> hw <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
>> Hi,
>>
>> does any of the Firefox versions that can be installed with pkg
>> actually work?
>
> Yes I've been using Firefox on FreeBSD for a very long time now,
> always installed from packages. Currently I'm running Firefox 68.01 on
> FreeBSD 12 with no problems at all.

ok

>>  Firefix continues to freeze, crash, being unable to
>> remember its settings,
>
> None of this.
>
>> to not show up at all when starting it other
>> than in the process list,
>
> Not sure what this means, I usually start it from a small script
> in .wmx (that's just how my window manager works) that just
> runs /usr/local/bin/firefox. Just typing firefox at a command prompt also
> works fine.

it means Firefox doesn't bring up a window or anything

>> and it usually can't be killed even with
>> kill -9.
>
> Never seen that, and my home directory is NFS mounted.

Guess what, it turned out that the broken NFS implementation of FreeBSD
is unable to handle file locks.  Apparently it is using some unexpected
ports --- I don't know which ones --- because it kinda worked when I
stopped firewalld on the NFS server.  That NFS server is serving the
same directories and others to other clients perfectly well with no
issues.  Then error messages showed up in /var/log/messages apparently
concerning file locks, leading me to a bug report about it.

At the end of the day, I decided to ditch FreeBSD for the server part
because its NFS implementation is unusable --- and who knows what other
issues may come up.  It's probably still fine for the clients because it
can be nicely PXE booted.

And now you say you got it to work with NFS.  How?  Neither v3, nor v4
work.
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Re: Firefox or what?

hw
In reply to this post by Andrea Venturoli
Andrea Venturoli <[hidden email]> writes:

> On 8/12/19 5:37 PM, hw wrote:
>> Hi,
>>
>> does any of the Firefox versions that can be installed with pkg
>> actually work?  Firefix continues to freeze, crash, being unable to
>> remember its settings, to not show up at all when starting it other
>> than in the process list, and it usually can't be killed even with
>> kill -9.
>
> I'm using firefox-esr on 11.2/amd64 and I don't have so many problems
> (although it sometimes hangs and I've incurred in a couple of bugs).

I tried both the "normal" version and the esr version, it made no
difference.

> What FreeBSD version are you using?

12 release

> Did you read pkg message?

Yes, and it's strange that so many things are disabled.  For this
particular application, it's probably an advantage.

> Other details on your system?

Well, FreeBSDs NFS implementation is broken, see my previous post ...

>> what's the alternative?
>
> Now, that's a good point; so far my dislike of FireFox is constantly
> growing, by I failed to find an alternative.
> What I tried:
>
> _ Chromium: while I just don't like it in general (and I don't like
> FireFox more and more mimicking it), it's the OmniBar which make me
> avoid it at all costs;
>
> _ PaleMoon: more or less worked (altough some sites refuse it), but
> it's now gone like SeaMonkey;
>
> _ Falkon: seems quite light; unfortunately it hangs much more
> frequently than FireFox (I'll try again after the upgrade to 11.3).
>
>
>
> If someone comes up with other options I might be glad to try them :)

Maybe Opera?  Does it have a decent adblocker?
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Re: Firefox or what?

hw
In reply to this post by tech-lists
tech-lists <[hidden email]> writes:

> On Mon, Aug 12, 2019 at 05:37:54PM +0200, hw wrote:
>>Hi,
>>
>>does any of the Firefox versions that can be installed with pkg
>>actually work?  Firefix continues to freeze, crash, being unable to
>>remember its settings, to not show up at all when starting it other
>>than in the process list, and it usually can't be killed even with
>>kill -9.
>>
>>If Firefox is incompatible with FreeBSD, what's the alternative?
>
> The version I'm using is 68.0.1 and freebsd is 12-stable r350717 and I have no
> firefox issues.
>
> I'm using pkg but I build my own packages with poudriere-devel.
>
> Need more information from you regarding the issue before even guessing what
> might be wrong. What version of firefox is installed? if installed from
> packages, what does pkg info | grep firefox say? What freebsd version?
> Anything in /var/log/messages that might indicate a firefox problem? What's
> the spec of the machine?
>
> Saying all that, have a look at the last suggestion (dated 2019-08-03 14:48:49
> UTC) on this thread it might be useful:
> https://bugs.freebsd.org/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=228855#c11 

Well, see my previous posts --- and this is like the next issue as I was
afraid of ... All this tells me that FreeBSD is a bad choice for the
purpose.
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Re: Firefox or what?

hw
In reply to this post by Polytropon
Polytropon <[hidden email]> writes:

> On Mon, 12 Aug 2019 17:37:54 +0200, hw wrote:
>> Hi,
>>
>> does any of the Firefox versions that can be installed with pkg
>> actually work?  Firefix continues to freeze, crash, being unable to
>> remember its settings, to not show up at all when starting it other
>> than in the process list, and it usually can't be killed even with
>> kill -9.
>
> I have a FreeBSD 12.0-p7/i386 installation running Firefox 68.0,
> and I don't have any problems. I even tried "modern" web pages,
> and even though Firefox sometimes seems to run a bit too slow,
> no crashes or freezes.
>
> But what you're describing rings a bell.
>
> Just to make sure you're not suffering from an inconsistent
> file system, boot your system in single-user mode and perform
> a forced full fsck on all filesystems, especially those carrying
> /usr/local and /home. Make sure you have the following setting
> in /etc/rc.conf:
>
> background_fsck="NO"
>
> Inconsistent file system can definitely cause the kind of problem
> you're seeing, so make sure it's not the case.
>
> NB: Does only apply to UFS. ;-)

The /home directories are on the NFS server wich uses xfs on hardware
RAID, and they work fine with the Linux version of Firefox when mounted
by a Debian server.

Other than that, you're right, the broken NFS implementation of FreeBSD
kinda simulates a corrupt file system.

>> If Firefox is incompatible with FreeBSD, what's the alternative?
>
> It isn't. Things that do not build or run on FreeBSD are either
> marked "BROKEN", or aren't part of the ports collection.

NFS should be marked BROKEN then. It's not only limited to exporting
whole file systems, a bug which makes it unusable for almost everything,
it is also unable to handle file locks.

I will have to re-evaluate if it's a good idea to use FreeBSD for DNS
servers.  I'll probably be better off using Centos for that like for
everything else.
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Re: Firefox or what?

Andrea Venturoli
In reply to this post by hw
On 8/12/19 9:46 PM, hw wrote:

> And now you say you got it to work with NFS.  How?  Neither v3, nor v4
> work.

Strange.
I've been using FireFox with my home on NFS since about... 15 years or so.
Now I learn it doesn't work...
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Re: Firefox or what?

Polytropon
In reply to this post by hw-2
On Tue, 13 Aug 2019 11:19:44 +0000 (UTC), Paul Pathiakis via freebsd-questions wrote:
>  Hi,
> Sadly, I don't believe you to be technically astute in that
> you seem to have issues with everything that work 'out of the
> box' in FreeBSD.

I think this is not the case here. The specific setup which
involves NFS that is buggy for some reason might explain a
lot of things, like "filesystem inconsistency lookalike".

However, checking for the common things (actual filesystem
inconsistency, defective RAM, buggy CPU, etc.) should always
be the first thing to do. If "cross-checking" with other
systems is possible, that also should happen.



> Apologies to the list, but this guy's has been taking up
> serious bandwidth for the last two weeks on non-existent
> issues.  He makes a statement about something not working
> and 5-10 respond 'works for me'.

That was _before_ the consideration of NFS came up. It might
very well be the reason for the problems described, even though
crashing and freezing is _not_ an appropriate action when there
are problems accessing files, but... in "modern" software, you
never know: one thread is started to open a file, another
thread goes ahead and expects the file open, tries to read
or write or whatever, and nothing happens... ;-)




--
Polytropon
Magdeburg, Germany
Happy FreeBSD user since 4.0
Andra moi ennepe, Mousa, ...
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Re: Firefox or what?

eteep
In reply to this post by hw-2
Mine will freeze and crash regularly as well. It was much worse at one time but I went to the configuration folder and moved it to a different name letting firefox set itself up again like it was first use. I forget where the folder was whether it was in .config or not. It helped a lot but didnt completely solve the problem. I'm using 11.2/amd64 so I'm hoping things are better in 12 when I take the leap.

--
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Re: Firefox or what?

Polytropon
On Tue, 13 Aug 2019 10:44:15 -0400, Eric wrote:
> Mine will freeze and crash regularly as well. It was much worse at
> one time but I went to the configuration folder and moved it to a
> different name letting firefox set itself up again like it was
> first use.

You can use the profile manager to do this, without having to deal
with configuration directories manually:

        % firefox -P
        % firefox -p
        % firefox -ProfileManager

However, configuration "bugs" should not cause Firefox to crash.



> I forget where the folder was whether it was in .config or not.

It should be ~/.mozilla/firefox, with subdirectories for each
profile that has been instantiated.



> It helped a lot but didnt completely solve the problem. I'm using
> 11.2/amd64 so I'm hoping things are better in 12 when I take the
> leap.

Check if a newer version of Firefox is available. In many cases,
performing an update will help.

Oh, and always check for filesystem inconsistencies... ;-)



--
Polytropon
Magdeburg, Germany
Happy FreeBSD user since 4.0
Andra moi ennepe, Mousa, ...
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Re: Firefox or what?

hw
In reply to this post by Andrea Venturoli
Andrea Venturoli <[hidden email]> writes:

> On 8/12/19 9:46 PM, hw wrote:
>
>> And now you say you got it to work with NFS.  How?  Neither v3, nor v4
>> work.
>
> Strange.
> I've been using FireFox with my home on NFS since about... 15 years or so.
> Now I learn it doesn't work...

So how did you get it to work?

After all this, I wouldn't be surprised if FreeBSD-NFS is incompatible
with Centos-NFS.  Have you tried that?  What will you do when you run
into bug 220004?
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Re: Firefox or what?

grahamperrin
In reply to this post by eteep
On 13/08/2019 15:44, Eric wrote:
> freeze and crash … 11.2


pkg query %M firefox | grep -A 5 bug

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Re: Firefox or what?

Lena
In reply to this post by hw-2
> I still couldn't find worthy replacement for Firefox. And I looked,
> trust me on that.

Palemoon. The only problem is to compile the latest version of Palemoon
under FreeBSD.

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Re: Firefox or what?

Andrea Venturoli
In reply to this post by hw
On 8/13/19 11:34 PM, hw wrote:

> So how did you get it to work?

By following the instructions in the handbook and reading the manual pages.

I've had this working for years with NFSv3 and it's working now after I
switched to NFSv4.
Perhaps if *you* post your configuration, we can look at it and see if
something is wrong.




> After all this, I wouldn't be surprised if FreeBSD-NFS is incompatible
> with Centos-NFS.

Sorry, but you didn't say that in your first post.
Again, this might be a problem with FreeBSD, a problem in CentOS, a
problem with how you configured them...
We cannot tell if you don't provide info.
Also, I'd be suprised if this only affected FireFox (which was the
original subject), as several other programs wouldn't work then...



> Have you tried that?

No.
Everything here is FreeBSD based.



> What will you do when you run into bug 220004?

I don't know.
I'm not using 12 yet: I see .0 releases (of any software) as potentially
immature and buggy and I'm absolutely not switching until 12.1 is out.
These are bugs I've heard of and are one more reason I'm NOT moving to
12 yet.
Then again, I'm happily working with 11.2 and 11.3 and I see no need to
upgrade for now.

If I ever run into it, I'll see what my options are.

If you are stuck with it, I suggest you seek help on freebsd-net.



  bye
        av.
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Re: Firefox or what?

MJ-2
Thanks Andrea for pointing this out.

On 14/08/2019 9:21 pm, Andrea Venturoli wrote:

> On 8/13/19 11:34 PM, hw wrote:
>
>> So how did you get it to work?
>
> By following the instructions in the handbook and reading the manual pages.
>
> I've had this working for years with NFSv3 and it's working now after I
> switched to NFSv4.
> Perhaps if *you* post your configuration, we can look at it and see if
> something is wrong.

I have to agree. While this list is for questions and there are many
here that are eager to help where they can, it's almost impossible to
answer questions like "It doesn't work; therefore FreeBSD is a failure".




To [hidden email] may I suggest:

A) we don't know what doesn't work, what you have tried and what
configuration you have. Examples of configuration files, log messages,
error codes and the like will help. Most people here are not clairvoyant.

B) Searching through bug lists to find a potential bug that might occur
in the sub-system you are utilising in FreeBSD seems a nonsensical
approach. Your time would be better spent giving us the information
needed to assist you.

C) State what actions you have taken, what you have read, what confuses
you. People can help if they know what your problem is.

D) Be specific. There's never too much information that you can provide
relevant to an issue.

In the end, you're free to ask vague questions; the list is free to give
you vague replies.

Mark
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Re: Firefox or what?

eteep
In reply to this post by eteep
I'll do my best. I'm a bit limited as to what I can do, I have poor internet connectivity. I can use my phone at around 28 Kbps. Some times of the month I have a higher speed connection running at around 1Mbps but I run out of quota quickly using the high speed connection. Symptoms occur regardless of speed.


On August 13, 2019 12:00:10 PM EDT, Paul Pathiakis <[hidden email]> wrote:

>I would suggest that we go into a very deep dive into what you're
>experience.
>This list is extremely helpful in resolving issues.
>However, no one can help if the configuration/circumstances are
>unknown.
>Potentially, the setup of firefox, the location of the binary... is it
>being used over NFS?  is the binary local?  etc
>If there is a bug, it needs to be resolved.
>P.
>
>On Tuesday, August 13, 2019, 10:39:15 AM EDT, Eric
><[hidden email]> wrote:  
>
>Mine will freeze and crash regularly as well. It was much worse at one
>time but I went to the configuration folder and moved it to a different
>name letting firefox set itself up again like it was first use. I
>forget where the folder was whether it was in .config or not. It helped
>a lot but didnt completely solve the problem. I'm using 11.2/amd64 so
>I'm hoping things are better in 12 when I take the leap.
>
>--
>Sent from my Android device with K-9 Mail. Please excuse my brevity.
>_______________________________________________
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>To unsubscribe, send any mail to
>"[hidden email]"
>  

--
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