FreeBSD 12.1 hypervisor management tools

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FreeBSD 12.1 hypervisor management tools

Stefan Parvu
Hi,

We got a new server, where we plan to install FreeBSD 12.1 amd64 and use Xen.
Is there anything we could use as GUI management tools for Xen on FreeBSD ?

Im looking for some graphical user interface management software to allow different people to create/manage
different VMs on top of Xen/FreeBSD.

Thanks,

Stefan Parvu
[hidden email]



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Re: FreeBSD 12.1 hypervisor management tools

freebsd-xen mailing list
Am Samstag, 4. Januar 2020, 18:32:26 CET schrieb Stefan Parvu:
> We got a new server, where we plan to install FreeBSD 12.1 amd64 and use
> Xen. Is there anything we could use as GUI management tools for Xen on
> FreeBSD ?
>
> Im looking for some graphical user interface management software to allow
> different people to create/manage different VMs on top of Xen/FreeBSD.
hmmm,

i darkly remember to worked with a virt-manager (remotely) years ago

https://virt-manager.org/

over libvirt on Xen, but not on FreeBSD dom0 yet.

virt-manager uses libvirt which seems "available" / buildable on FreeBSD:
https://forums.freebsd.org/threads/libvirt-libxl-on-freebsd.51862/

see:
https://virt-manager.org/

but at that time it was not "complete". I use / prefer console based tools /
work for xen management until today which gives full access  to xen's
features - but this might help you for your needs.

hth,
best regards,


niels.

--
 ---
 Niels Dettenbach
 Syndicat IT & Internet
 http://www.syndicat.com
 PGP: https://syndicat.com/pub_key.asc
 ---
 






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Re: FreeBSD 12.1 hypervisor management tools

subbsd
In reply to this post by Stefan Parvu
Hi,

On Sat, Jan 4, 2020 at 8:32 PM Stefan Parvu <[hidden email]> wrote:

>
> Hi,
>
> We got a new server, where we plan to install FreeBSD 12.1 amd64 and use Xen.
> Is there anything we could use as GUI management tools for Xen on FreeBSD ?
>
> Im looking for some graphical user interface management software to allow different people to create/manage
> different VMs on top of Xen/FreeBSD.
>
> Thanks,
>
> Stefan Parvu
> [hidden email]

In addition to the virt-manager, we have CBSD[1]. It can manage XEN[2]

--
[1] -- https://www.freshports.org/sysutils/cbsd/
[2] -- https://www.reddit.com/r/freebsd/comments/ehvxdb/freebsd_xen_live_migration_freebsd_guest_via_cbsd/
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Re: FreeBSD 12.1 hypervisor management tools

Stefan Parvu
Cheers,

Okay, so there are some options. Will have a look on virt-manager and cbsd.

thanks a lot for pointers

Stefan Parvu
[hidden email]

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Re: FreeBSD 12.1 hypervisor management tools

Stefan Parvu
>
> Okay, so there are some options. Will have a look on virt-manager and cbsd.


libvirtd, virt-manager: no go.

* I had to rebuild libvirtd with Xen support

* got occasional core dumps from libvirtd

* virt-manager is useless, cannot be used to create a simple guests from debian to centos or freebsd

* got all sorts of errors from virt-manager, which does not let me create or boot the guest after configuration  

* probable easier is just to stick with xl cli

cbsd: havent tried yet.

Thanks,
Stefan
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Re: FreeBSD 12.1 hypervisor management tools

Roger Pau Monné
On Sun, Jan 12, 2020 at 09:12:01PM +0200, Stefan Parvu wrote:
> >
> > Okay, so there are some options. Will have a look on virt-manager and cbsd.
>
>
> libvirtd, virt-manager: no go.
>
> * I had to rebuild libvirtd with Xen support
>
> * got occasional core dumps from libvirt

Can you report those? (ie: send the dumps here so they can be analyzed
and either fixed or forwarded to the appropriate upstream project)

Without us getting detailed bug reports it's very likely that this is
not going to improve.

>
> * virt-manager is useless, cannot be used to create a simple guests from debian to centos or freebsd
>
> * got all sorts of errors from virt-manager, which does not let me create or boot the guest after configuration  

This should also be properly reported, what did you try, what did you
expect and what did happen instead.

Again, without getting reports it's not likely that this is going to
improve. I'm adding the FreeBSD libvirt maintainer so he is aware.

Thanks, Roger.
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Re: FreeBSD 12.1 hypervisor management tools

Stefan Parvu
>>
>> libvirtd, virt-manager: no go.
>>
>> * I had to rebuild libvirtd with Xen support
>>
>> * got occasional core dumps from libvirt
>
> Can you report those? (ie: send the dumps here so they can be analyzed
> and either fixed or forwarded to the appropriate upstream project)


sure. I should put a list of defects. I need to repeat these.

I was in hurry to check on the overall state of the project. But Im curious: has
anyone at least tried, meaning really to use virt-manager for Xen on FreeBSD ?
Because I was hitting one error after another one.

Stefan
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Re: FreeBSD 12.1 hypervisor management tools

Roger Pau Monné
On Tue, Jan 14, 2020 at 12:47:54AM +0200, Stefan Parvu wrote:

> >>
> >> libvirtd, virt-manager: no go.
> >>
> >> * I had to rebuild libvirtd with Xen support
> >>
> >> * got occasional core dumps from libvirt
> >
> > Can you report those? (ie: send the dumps here so they can be analyzed
> > and either fixed or forwarded to the appropriate upstream project)
>
>
> sure. I should put a list of defects. I need to repeat these.
>
> I was in hurry to check on the overall state of the project. But Im curious: has
> anyone at least tried, meaning really to use virt-manager for Xen on FreeBSD ?

I don't use libvirt at all, so I never tried it myself. I know it
works on Linux and is tested as part of the Xen CI loop, see the
-libvirt jobs in any Xen CI loop output:

http://logs.test-lab.xenproject.org/osstest/logs/146050/

So whatever is broken it's likely to be FreeBSD specific and will
require someone from the FreeBSD community to diagnose and propose
fixes.

The first step should be to report those errors, and figure out
whether someone has interest in getting libvirt working on FreeBSD/Xen
and maintaining it in a sane state. If there's no interest we should
drop the Xen option from the libvirt port to not give users false
expectations.

Thanks, Roger
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Re: FreeBSD 12.1 hypervisor management tools

Stefan Parvu
> The first step should be to report those errors, and figure out
> whether someone has interest in getting libvirt working on FreeBSD/Xen
> and maintaining it in a sane state. If there's no interest we should
> drop the Xen option from the libvirt port to not give users false
> expectations.

Right. Makes sense. I will handle that in next days and make a short report about it.
If libvirt is not an option I would still like to see how Xen compares with bhyve and kvm
for some of our applications and usage.

Stefan
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Re: FreeBSD 12.1 hypervisor management tools

Stefan Parvu
here, some ideas:

https://bugs.freebsd.org/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=243395 <https://bugs.freebsd.org/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=243395>
https://bugs.freebsd.org/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=243397 <https://bugs.freebsd.org/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=243397>


Stefan Parvu
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> On 14. Jan 2020, at 16.42, Stefan Parvu <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
>> The first step should be to report those errors, and figure out
>> whether someone has interest in getting libvirt working on FreeBSD/Xen
>> and maintaining it in a sane state. If there's no interest we should
>> drop the Xen option from the libvirt port to not give users false
>> expectations.
>
> Right. Makes sense. I will handle that in next days and make a short report about it.
> If libvirt is not an option I would still like to see how Xen compares with bhyve and kvm
> for some of our applications and usage.
>
> Stefan
> _______________________________________________
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> https://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-xen
> To unsubscribe, send any mail to "[hidden email]"

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Re: FreeBSD 12.1 hypervisor management tools

David P. Discher
In reply to this post by Stefan Parvu
This pop’ed up in my inbox when I was searching for something else … but by far, your best solution will be XOA

 - https://xen-orchestra.com

Not specifically “not” freebsd … it’s complicated enough to deploy via NPM or yarn or whatever - I’d recommend starting with their appliance.  I’m running XCP-ng, with XOA control.  You can have multiple XOAs controller your clusters, so you can run their linux packaged VM, while working on getting it to run under freebsd, if desired.

All the other tool listed in this thread are incomplete and when I was last evaluating, about 6 month ago, where missing too many key features.

I am not using FreeBSD as Dom0 - but using it as the backing NAS OS. And running a mix of CentOS and FreeBSD VMs.  A few years  ago, I test FreeBSD Dom0 … and still needed a lot of work to be production ready … as I the other thread in Xen in Feb 2020, from Brian … 'abysmal network performance’ … and I believe disk IO was piss poor too.

If you are all FreeBSD, or mostly FreeBSD VMs … bhyve and vm-bhyve are nice, but no GUI. (if you don’t require more than 1Gbps network performance ).  There was some, somewhat secret work on full VPS (virtual private server) kernel work, that got near (90-95%) theoretical hardware performance on Disk and Net IO, but I’m not sure if that was every merged or released publicly.   It was planned to be publicly merged … but not sure where that project went. (This work be helpful for Xen too ??)

I also implemented iSCSI + FreeNAS API into vm-bhyve a few years ago,

 - https://github.com/daviddpd/vm-bhyve/blob/freenas-iscsi/README-ISCSI.md 

(make sure you are on the freenas-iscsi branch) - and the corresponding API ...

 - https://github.com/daviddpd/ixnas-api

But these are a few years out of date and may need work.  Though, in the bhyve+iSCSI - the awesome thing is that each virtual disk was a raw block device mapped to the VM, as a iSCSI LUN, provisioned as a ZFS zvol (on the remote NAS via the API). “Cloning” is done on the ZFS side.  With Xen+XOA, the only two SR (storage repositories) are NFS and iSCSI+LVM.  And each hypervisor makes a single NFS or iSCSI mount.  Then each Virtual disk is managed as a .vhd on NFS.  With iSCSI+LVM, then the iSCSI LUN is managed with LVM, and formatted with ext3(4?) or xfs, and the .vhd is keep as a file in that logical volume. Thin provisioning not available with iSCSI on XOA/XCP. Thin provisioning/snapshots on NFS done with features of .vhd in XOA/XCP. With my iSCSI+vm-bhyve, then thin provisioning, snapshots and cloning are done in ZFS, on the NAS side, not in the Dom0.

These are the only supported options in XOA - though Xen can likely do other things, they are implemented for easy of use in the Web UI.  Ideally I’d love to implement my iSCSI+ZFS for Xen and into XOA.

--
David P. Discher
https://davidpdischer.com/


> On Jan 4, 2020, at 9:32 AM, Stefan Parvu <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> Hi,
>
> We got a new server, where we plan to install FreeBSD 12.1 amd64 and use Xen.
> Is there anything we could use as GUI management tools for Xen on FreeBSD ?
>
> Im looking for some graphical user interface management software to allow different people to create/manage
> different VMs on top of Xen/FreeBSD.
>
> Thanks,
>
> Stefan Parvu
> [hidden email]
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> [hidden email] mailing list
> https://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-xen
> To unsubscribe, send any mail to "[hidden email]"

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