pkgng woes

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pkgng woes

Beeblebrox
Pkgng, as a concept may be great, but it's not really working - at least for me:

1. pkg2ng conversion does not do a complete job and I have about half of my ports in purgatory or a quasi-installed state. The program runs and is installed but pkgdb does not have a record for it. So my ports updates do a half-ass job.
2. I am used to portmaster and I accept that portupgrade is "more ready" to be used with pkgng than portmaster. However, portmaster has the "--check-depends" option which I would normally use to correct problem #1, alas I see no similar function in portupgrade or pkg. The "portupgrade -Ffu" and "pkg check" commands don't do the trick either.
3. I have some ports that I never want to install (like accessibility/atk or net/avahi). The new pkgtools.conf has a nice feature of IGNORE_CATEGORIES and HOLD_PKGS which I hope will allow me to "blacklist" those ports but I have my doubts as the knob is PKGS and not PORTS - so we'll see. Separately though, while trying to get my system pkgng complient and doing updates, there have been some ports which were pulled in that I whish to remove. As in #2, portmaster --check-depends did a nice job of this and allowed the dependency to be removed from the portsdb structure - so same problem here as #2.
4. I know how to do +IGNOREME in the portsdb and that is a very roundabout way of solving an sqlite entry.
5. pkg add does not respect existing port version information on the system. If you try to install a package and its dependencies, pkg tries to pull in its own preferred version. This happened for perl5 - I have 5.16 already on the system but pkg kept trying to install 5.14. The only solution was to use the old "pkg-add -i" to install one-by-one and without the dependencies. Interesting how pkgng does not have the -i (no-deps) option??
6. portupgrade's -i (interactive) also completely ignores you when adding a new port. It just goes and does its thing then happily informs you of the its fait accompli.

Ubuntu's Synaptic gives more control than this...
FreeBSD-11-current_amd64_root-on-zfs_RadeonKMS
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Re: pkgng woes

Beeblebrox
update:
In pkgtools.conf, the IGNORE_CATEGORIES works and prevents unwanted ports from being installed, while HOLD_PKGS does not work when using portupgrade and I get my nemesis net/avahi-app installed anyway (whether I want it or not).
FreeBSD-11-current_amd64_root-on-zfs_RadeonKMS
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Re: pkgng woes

Adam McDougall
In reply to this post by Beeblebrox
Answering this in-line as a user of pkgng and binary packages:

On 11/9/2012 4:53 AM, Beeblebrox wrote:
> Pkgng, as a concept may be great, but it's not really working - at least for
> me:
>
> 1. pkg2ng conversion does not do a complete job and I have about half of my
> ports in purgatory or a quasi-installed state. The program runs and is
> installed but pkgdb does not have a record for it. So my ports updates do a
> half-ass job.
If it didn't work right, the problem should have been solved at that
time or the conversion
undone (pkg2ng made a backup of /var/db/pkg) so you don't move forward
with a partial db.
The package database it was trying to convert may have had its own
problems, resulting in
the failure, but if you don't have the error messages and have continued
since then, it may be
too late.  It is hard to say what future issues will arise from a
compromised package db, but that
is what you now have.  It may be best to scrap it and "pkg install"
everything you need
over top of your current install so the db is correct.  (After
appropriate backups)

> 2. I am used to portmaster and I accept that portupgrade is "more ready" to
> be used with pkgng than portmaster. However, portmaster has the
> "--check-depends" option which I would normally use to correct problem #1,
> alas I see no similar function in portupgrade or pkg. The "portupgrade -Ffu"
> and "pkg check" commands don't do the trick either.
I have not tried portmaster with pkgdb yet but I understand recent
versions of it support
pkgng.  Have you looked into that?
> 3. I have some ports that I never want to install (like accessibility/atk or
> net/avahi). The new pkgtools.conf has a nice feature of IGNORE_CATEGORIES
> and HOLD_PKGS which I hope will allow me to "blacklist" those ports but I
> have my doubts as the knob is PKGS and not PORTS - so we'll see. Separately
> though, while trying to get my system pkgng complient and doing updates,
> there have been some ports which were pulled in that I whish to remove. As
> in #2, portmaster --check-depends did a nice job of this and allowed the
> dependency to be removed from the portsdb structure - so same problem here
> as #2.
I also had some similar concerns.  I don't think you have much of a
choice at the current
stage, the packages on pkgbeta are being compiled a single way just like
they were with
the previous package format.  This is expected to improve in the future,
but if it really
concerns you, it is best to use something like poudriere to make a
custom set of packages
(its pretty easy, really!) Once I tried it for my site, I am thrilled.  
Especially because my
packages are complete, prompt, and customized.
> 4. I know how to do +IGNOREME in the portsdb and that is a very roundabout
> way of solving an sqlite entry.
> 5. pkg add does not respect existing port version information on the system.
> If you try to install a package and its dependencies, pkg tries to pull in
> its own preferred version. This happened for perl5 - I have 5.16 already on
> the system but pkg kept trying to install 5.14. The only solution was to use
> the old "pkg-add -i" to install one-by-one and without the dependencies.
> Interesting how pkgng does not have the -i (no-deps) option??
Same answer as #3 really.  I also preferred 5.16 but don't really care
as long as it works,
so once I understood the deps in pkgbeta wanted 5.14 I just accepted
that until I built
my own packages with all 5.16.
> 6. portupgrade's -i (interactive) also completely ignores you when adding a
> new port. It just goes and does its thing then happily informs you of the
> its fait accompli.
I haven't used portupgrade in a few years, and I want to avoid going
back to dealing with
it's database issues

>
> Ubuntu's Synaptic gives more control than this...
>
>
>
>
> --
> View this message in context: http://freebsd.1045724.n5.nabble.com/pkgng-woes-tp5759489.html
> Sent from the freebsd-ports mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
> _______________________________________________
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Re: pkgng woes

Anton Shterenlikht
        > 2. I am used to portmaster and I accept that portupgrade is "more ready" to
        > be used with pkgng than portmaster. However, portmaster has the
        > "--check-depends" option which I would normally use to correct problem #1,
        > alas I see no similar function in portupgrade or pkg. The "portupgrade -Ffu"
        > and "pkg check" commands don't do the trick either.
        I have not tried portmaster with pkgdb yet but I understand recent
        versions of it support
        pkgng.  Have you looked into that?

portmaster --check-depends does work for me with pkgng
on ia64 and sparc64 -current.

Anton
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Re: pkgng woes

Beeblebrox
In reply to this post by Adam McDougall

- I did not realize that pkg2ng did not convert correctly, until portmaster started to try and install stuff that I knew was already on the system. Too late now. My db was probably problematic to start with

<quote author="Adam McDougall"> I have not tried portmaster with pkgdb yet but I understand recent versions of it support pkgng[/quote]
- That's the point! pkgng broke my portmaster (and everyone else's) and now I resort to slogging through stuff.

- I am planning on trying poudriere, installed it but have not gotten around to setting it up. Plus I want a web interface using lighttpd and I have to fiddle the instructions for jenkins to make it work. When I do set it up I can do a complete re-install. I did want an up-to-date system until I got around to it though.

<quote author="Adam McDougall">I haven't used portupgrade in a few years, and I want to avoid going back to dealing with it's database issues[/quote]
My sentiments exactly, but I am under the impression that pkgng and portupgrade use the same sqlite pkg database (pkgdb is a portupgrade feature) to track the installed packages, while portmaster is not quite yet integrated into that sqlite db.

Thanks for the suggestions, I have to urgently migrate to poudriere it seems :(
FreeBSD-11-current_amd64_root-on-zfs_RadeonKMS
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Re: pkgng woes

Beeblebrox
@anton
portmaster --check-depends does not work for me.  Shows everything as fine but when I specifically target a port: # portmaster -i graphics/gimp for example, I get a long list of ports to be installed - meaning not all of the existing ports have been registered correctly, hence --check depends will not work. Once I re-install all of the "missing depends" and run the same command (# portmaster -i graphics/gimp) then there are no problems nor list of missing depends.
FreeBSD-11-current_amd64_root-on-zfs_RadeonKMS
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Re: pkgng woes

Kimmo Paasiala-2
On Fri, Nov 9, 2012 at 2:39 PM, Beeblebrox <[hidden email]> wrote:

> @anton
> portmaster --check-depends does not work for me.  Shows everything as fine
> but when I specifically target a port: *# portmaster -i graphics/gimp* for
> example, I get a long list of ports to be installed - meaning not all of the
> existing ports have been registered correctly, hence --check depends will
> not work. Once I re-install all of the "missing depends" and run the same
> command (*# portmaster -i graphics/gimp*) then there are no problems nor
> list of missing depends.
>
>

'portmaster --check-depends' has no equivalent in PKGNG because it
deals directly with the /var/db/pkg/*/+REQUIRED_BY etc. files that are
no longer used when using PKGNG.
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Re: pkgng woes

Anton Shterenlikht
In reply to this post by Beeblebrox
        @anton
        portmaster --check-depends does not work for me.  Shows everything as fine
        but when I specifically target a port: *# portmaster -i graphics/gimp* for
        example, I get a long list of ports to be installed - meaning not all of the
        existing ports have been registered correctly, hence --check depends will
        not work. Once I re-install all of the "missing depends" and run the same
        command (*# portmaster -i graphics/gimp*) then there are no problems nor
        list of missing depends.

Well... if it's any consolation, my convertion
to pkgng wasn't easy either. In fact, I'n not
sure I'm all there yet.

My problem was due to using an outdated portmaster pkgng patch.
Note: this is no longer an issue.
Anyway, I ended up with a corrupted pkg database.
I had to update many ports manually.
Now that the pkg database is fully under pngng
control (I'm just a user and don't follow
the technical details, hence my using of non-technical
language) I think portmaster can work with it.
For example portmaster --check-port-dbdir seems
to give correct results.

Anyway, I think the idea is to remove a lot
of functionality from portmaster and give
it to pkgng. For example checking for missing
dependencies, or shared libs. However, I'm used
to working with ports only, never with packages.
I still don't understand if pkgng is the tool
for me or not. People keep talking of poudriere,
but again I'm not sure if some of the portmaster
functionality is supposed to be taken over
by pourdriere or not.

Anton
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Re: pkgng woes

Bryan Drewery
In reply to this post by Beeblebrox
On 11/9/2012 6:32 AM, Beeblebrox wrote:
>
> - I did not realize that pkg2ng did not convert correctly, until portmaster
> started to try and install stuff that I knew was already on the system. Too
> late now. My db was probably problematic to start with
>
>  I have not tried portmaster with pkgdb yet but I understand recent versions
> of it support pkgng[/quote]
> - That's the point! pkgng broke my portmaster (and everyone else's) and now
> I resort to slogging through stuff.

This should not happen if you have the latest portmaster port and use
the PKGNGPATCH option.

>
> - I am planning on trying poudriere, installed it but have not gotten around
> to setting it up. Plus I want a web interface using lighttpd and I have to
> fiddle the instructions for jenkins to make it work. When I do set it up I
> can do a complete re-install. I did want an up-to-date system until I got
> around to it though.

It is not required that you use binary packages with pkgng. You can
continue using ports with portmaster/portupgrade just fine.

>
> I haven't used portupgrade in a few years, and I want to avoid going back to
> dealing with it's database issues[/quote]
> My sentiments exactly, but I am under the impression that pkgng and
> portupgrade use the same sqlite pkg database (*pkgdb* is a portupgrade
> feature) to track the installed packages, while portmaster is not quite yet
> integrated into that sqlite db.

No, portupgrade still has its own pkgdb, that feeds from the pkgng
sqlite database. This is temporary though and pkgdb will be going away
completely soon, as it is redundant with pkgng.

Portmaster *is* fully ready for pkgng, and does utilize the pkgng tools
to read from its database.

>
> Thanks for the suggestions, I have to urgently migrate to poudriere it seems
> :(

If you are having trouble using ports, please report the issues to the
maintainer or upstream as well.

>
>
>
> --
> View this message in context: http://freebsd.1045724.n5.nabble.com/pkgng-woes-tp5759489p5759519.html
> Sent from the freebsd-ports mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
> _______________________________________________
> [hidden email] mailing list
> http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-ports
> To unsubscribe, send any mail to "[hidden email]"
>

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Re: pkgng woes

Chris Rees-2
In reply to this post by Beeblebrox
On 9 Nov 2012 09:53, "Beeblebrox" <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> Pkgng, as a concept may be great, but it's not really working - at least
for
> me:
>
> 1. pkg2ng conversion does not do a complete job and I have about half of
my
> ports in purgatory or a quasi-installed state. The program runs and is
> installed but pkgdb does not have a record for it. So my ports updates do
a
> half-ass job.
> 2. I am used to portmaster and I accept that portupgrade is "more ready"
to
> be used with pkgng than portmaster. However, portmaster has the
> "--check-depends" option which I would normally use to correct problem #1,
> alas I see no similar function in portupgrade or pkg. The "portupgrade
-Ffu"
> and "pkg check" commands don't do the trick either.
> 3. I have some ports that I never want to install (like accessibility/atk
or
> net/avahi). The new pkgtools.conf has a nice feature of IGNORE_CATEGORIES
> and HOLD_PKGS which I hope will allow me to "blacklist" those ports but I
> have my doubts as the knob is PKGS and not PORTS - so we'll see.
Separately
> though, while trying to get my system pkgng complient and doing updates,
> there have been some ports which were pulled in that I whish to remove. As
> in #2, portmaster --check-depends did a nice job of this and allowed the
> dependency to be removed from the portsdb structure - so same problem here
> as #2.
> 4. I know how to do +IGNOREME in the portsdb and that is a very roundabout
> way of solving an sqlite entry.
> 5. pkg add does not respect existing port version information on the
system.
> If you try to install a package and its dependencies, pkg tries to pull in
> its own preferred version. This happened for perl5 - I have 5.16 already
on
> the system but pkg kept trying to install 5.14. The only solution was to
use
> the old "pkg-add -i" to install one-by-one and without the dependencies.
> Interesting how pkgng does not have the -i (no-deps) option??

Mixing versions with binary packages is a bad idea anyway.  Packages are
built with a certain set of dependencies, and you can't mix and match (this
has always been the case).  If you want to do this, use ports.  Packages
are designed to work as a set, hence pkg upgrade just upgrades everything
to the latest version.

Chris
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Re: pkgng woes

Jeffrey Bouquet


--- On Fri, 11/9/12, Chris Rees <[hidden email]> wrote:

> From: Chris Rees <[hidden email]>
> Subject: Re: pkgng woes
> To: "Beeblebrox" <[hidden email]>
> Cc: [hidden email]
> Date: Friday, November 9, 2012, 8:18 AM
> On 9 Nov 2012 09:53, "Beeblebrox"
> <[hidden email]>
> wrote:
> >
> > Pkgng, as a concept may be great, but it's not really
> working - at least
> for
> > me:
> >
> > 1. pkg2ng conversion does not do a complete job and I
> have about half of
> my
> > ports in purgatory or a quasi-installed state. The
> program runs and is
> > installed but pkgdb does not have a record for it. So
> my ports updates do
> a
> > half-ass job.
> > 2. I am used to portmaster and I accept that
> portupgrade is "more ready"
> to
> > be used with pkgng than portmaster. However, portmaster
> has the
> > "--check-depends" option which I would normally use to
> correct problem #1,
> > alas I see no similar function in portupgrade or pkg.
> The "portupgrade
> -Ffu"
> > and "pkg check" commands don't do the trick either.
> > 3. I have some ports that I never want to install (like
> accessibility/atk
> or
> > net/avahi). The new pkgtools.conf has a nice feature of
> IGNORE_CATEGORIES
> > and HOLD_PKGS which I hope will allow me to "blacklist"
> those ports but I
> > have my doubts as the knob is PKGS and not PORTS - so
> we'll see.
> Separately
> > though, while trying to get my system pkgng complient
> and doing updates,
> > there have been some ports which were pulled in that I
> whish to remove. As
> > in #2, portmaster --check-depends did a nice job of
> this and allowed the
> > dependency to be removed from the portsdb structure -
> so same problem here
> > as #2.
> > 4. I know how to do +IGNOREME in the portsdb and that
> is a very roundabout
> > way of solving an sqlite entry.
> > 5. pkg add does not respect existing port version
> information on the
> system.
> > If you try to install a package and its dependencies,
> pkg tries to pull in
> > its own preferred version. This happened for perl5 - I
> have 5.16 already
> on
> > the system but pkg kept trying to install 5.14. The
> only solution was to
> use
> > the old "pkg-add -i" to install one-by-one and without
> the dependencies.
> > Interesting how pkgng does not have the -i (no-deps)
> option??
>
> Mixing versions with binary packages is a bad idea
> anyway.  Packages are
> built with a certain set of dependencies, and you can't mix
> and match (this
> has always been the case).  If you want to do this, use
> ports.  Packages
> are designed to work as a set, hence pkg upgrade just
> upgrades everything
> to the latest version.
>
> Chris
> _______________________________________________
> [hidden email]
> mailing list
> http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-ports
> To unsubscribe, send any mail to "[hidden email]"
>

Does that mean that, for example, when I upgraded a slew of
packages ( pkg_add -f ...) that depended upon pkg-config
but installed and theoretically now depending upon pkgconf, that I'd
have to do them all by *ports* if using /pkg/ not /var/db/pkg?
That would seriously hinder fully half of my upgrades, making them
last a magnitude of hours longer each time...

J. Bouquet
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Re: pkgng woes

Jeffrey Bouquet
In reply to this post by Anton Shterenlikht


--- On Fri, 11/9/12, Anton Shterenlikht <[hidden email]> wrote:

> From: Anton Shterenlikht <[hidden email]>
> Subject: Re: pkgng woes
> To: [hidden email], [hidden email]
> Date: Friday, November 9, 2012, 5:22 AM
>     @anton
>     portmaster --check-depends does not work
> for me.  Shows everything as fine
>     but when I specifically target a port: *#
> portmaster -i graphics/gimp* for
>     example, I get a long list of ports to be
> installed - meaning not all of the
>     existing ports have been registered
> correctly, hence --check depends will
>     not work. Once I re-install all of the
> "missing depends" and run the same
>     command (*# portmaster -i graphics/gimp*)
> then there are no problems nor
>     list of missing depends.
>
> Well... if it's any consolation, my convertion
> to pkgng wasn't easy either. In fact, I'n not
> sure I'm all there yet.
>
> My problem was due to using an outdated portmaster pkgng
> patch.
> Note: this is no longer an issue.
> Anyway, I ended up with a corrupted pkg database.
> I had to update many ports manually.
> Now that the pkg database is fully under pngng
> control (I'm just a user and don't follow
> the technical details, hence my using of non-technical
> language) I think portmaster can work with it.
> For example portmaster --check-port-dbdir seems
> to give correct results.
>
> Anyway, I think the idea is to remove a lot
> of functionality from portmaster and give
> it to pkgng. For example checking for missing
> dependencies, or shared libs. However, I'm used
> to working with ports only, never with packages.
> I still don't understand if pkgng is the tool
> for me or not. People keep talking of poudriere,
> but again I'm not sure if some of the portmaster
> functionality is supposed to be taken over
> by pourdriere or not.
>
> Anton
> _______________________________________________
> [hidden email]
> mailing list
> http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-ports
> To unsubscribe, send any mail to "[hidden email]"
>
FWIW,
The wiki (FreeBSDPackageBuildingComparison) says poudriere requires
ZSH.  I'd like to write more on this topic but am out of time.

J. Bouquet
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Re: pkgng woes

Jeffrey Bouquet
In reply to this post by Kimmo Paasiala-2


--- On Fri, 11/9/12, Kimmo Paasiala <[hidden email]> wrote:

> From: Kimmo Paasiala <[hidden email]>
> Subject: Re: pkgng woes
> To: "Beeblebrox" <[hidden email]>
> Cc: [hidden email]
> Date: Friday, November 9, 2012, 4:54 AM
> On Fri, Nov 9, 2012 at 2:39 PM,
> Beeblebrox <[hidden email]>
> wrote:
> > @anton
> > portmaster --check-depends does not work for me. 
> Shows everything as fine
> > but when I specifically target a port: *# portmaster -i
> graphics/gimp* for
> > example, I get a long list of ports to be installed -
> meaning not all of the
> > existing ports have been registered correctly, hence
> --check depends will
> > not work. Once I re-install all of the "missing
> depends" and run the same
> > command (*# portmaster -i graphics/gimp*) then there
> are no problems nor
> > list of missing depends.
> >
> >
>
> 'portmaster --check-depends' has no equivalent in PKGNG
> because it
> deals directly with the /var/db/pkg/*/+REQUIRED_BY etc.
> files that are
> no longer used when using PKGNG.
> _______________________________________________
> [hidden email]
> mailing list
> http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-ports
> To unsubscribe, send any mail to "[hidden email]"
>
It's corollary (pkgdb -F --omit-check) would also be
obsolete? Would there be an equivalent in place?

J. Bouquet
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Re: pkgng woes

Bryan Drewery
In reply to this post by Jeffrey Bouquet
On 11/9/2012 12:42 PM, Jeffrey Bouquet wrote:

>
>
> --- On Fri, 11/9/12, Anton Shterenlikht <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
>> From: Anton Shterenlikht <[hidden email]>
>> Subject: Re: pkgng woes
>> To: [hidden email], [hidden email]
>> Date: Friday, November 9, 2012, 5:22 AM
>>     @anton
>>     portmaster --check-depends does not work
>> for me.  Shows everything as fine
>>     but when I specifically target a port: *#
>> portmaster -i graphics/gimp* for
>>     example, I get a long list of ports to be
>> installed - meaning not all of the
>>     existing ports have been registered
>> correctly, hence --check depends will
>>     not work. Once I re-install all of the
>> "missing depends" and run the same
>>     command (*# portmaster -i graphics/gimp*)
>> then there are no problems nor
>>     list of missing depends.
>>
>> Well... if it's any consolation, my convertion
>> to pkgng wasn't easy either. In fact, I'n not
>> sure I'm all there yet.
>>
>> My problem was due to using an outdated portmaster pkgng
>> patch.
>> Note: this is no longer an issue.
>> Anyway, I ended up with a corrupted pkg database.
>> I had to update many ports manually.
>> Now that the pkg database is fully under pngng
>> control (I'm just a user and don't follow
>> the technical details, hence my using of non-technical
>> language) I think portmaster can work with it.
>> For example portmaster --check-port-dbdir seems
>> to give correct results.
>>
>> Anyway, I think the idea is to remove a lot
>> of functionality from portmaster and give
>> it to pkgng. For example checking for missing
>> dependencies, or shared libs. However, I'm used
>> to working with ports only, never with packages.
>> I still don't understand if pkgng is the tool
>> for me or not. People keep talking of poudriere,
>> but again I'm not sure if some of the portmaster
>> functionality is supposed to be taken over
>> by pourdriere or not.
>>
>> Anton
>> _______________________________________________
>> [hidden email]
>> mailing list
>> http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-ports
>> To unsubscribe, send any mail to "[hidden email]"
>>
> FWIW,
> The wiki (FreeBSDPackageBuildingComparison) says poudriere requires
> ZSH.  I'd like to write more on this topic but am out of time.

ZFS*

It uses base /bin/sh, not zsh.

>
> J. Bouquet
> _______________________________________________
> [hidden email] mailing list
> http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-ports
> To unsubscribe, send any mail to "[hidden email]"
>

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Re: pkgng woes

Chris Rees-2
In reply to this post by Jeffrey Bouquet
On 9 Nov 2012 18:34, "Jeffrey Bouquet" <[hidden email]> wrote:

>
>
>
> --- On Fri, 11/9/12, Chris Rees <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> > From: Chris Rees <[hidden email]>
> > Subject: Re: pkgng woes
> > To: "Beeblebrox" <[hidden email]>
> > Cc: [hidden email]
> > Date: Friday, November 9, 2012, 8:18 AM
> > On 9 Nov 2012 09:53, "Beeblebrox"
> > <[hidden email]>
> > wrote:
> > >
> > > Pkgng, as a concept may be great, but it's not really
> > working - at least
> > for
> > > me:
> > >
> > > 1. pkg2ng conversion does not do a complete job and I
> > have about half of
> > my
> > > ports in purgatory or a quasi-installed state. The
> > program runs and is
> > > installed but pkgdb does not have a record for it. So
> > my ports updates do
> > a
> > > half-ass job.
> > > 2. I am used to portmaster and I accept that
> > portupgrade is "more ready"
> > to
> > > be used with pkgng than portmaster. However, portmaster
> > has the
> > > "--check-depends" option which I would normally use to
> > correct problem #1,
> > > alas I see no similar function in portupgrade or pkg.
> > The "portupgrade
> > -Ffu"
> > > and "pkg check" commands don't do the trick either.
> > > 3. I have some ports that I never want to install (like
> > accessibility/atk
> > or
> > > net/avahi). The new pkgtools.conf has a nice feature of
> > IGNORE_CATEGORIES
> > > and HOLD_PKGS which I hope will allow me to "blacklist"
> > those ports but I
> > > have my doubts as the knob is PKGS and not PORTS - so
> > we'll see.
> > Separately
> > > though, while trying to get my system pkgng complient
> > and doing updates,
> > > there have been some ports which were pulled in that I
> > whish to remove. As
> > > in #2, portmaster --check-depends did a nice job of
> > this and allowed the
> > > dependency to be removed from the portsdb structure -
> > so same problem here
> > > as #2.
> > > 4. I know how to do +IGNOREME in the portsdb and that
> > is a very roundabout
> > > way of solving an sqlite entry.
> > > 5. pkg add does not respect existing port version
> > information on the
> > system.
> > > If you try to install a package and its dependencies,
> > pkg tries to pull in
> > > its own preferred version. This happened for perl5 - I
> > have 5.16 already
> > on
> > > the system but pkg kept trying to install 5.14. The
> > only solution was to
> > use
> > > the old "pkg-add -i" to install one-by-one and without
> > the dependencies.
> > > Interesting how pkgng does not have the -i (no-deps)
> > option??
> >
> > Mixing versions with binary packages is a bad idea
> > anyway.  Packages are
> > built with a certain set of dependencies, and you can't mix
> > and match (this
> > has always been the case).  If you want to do this, use
> > ports.  Packages
> > are designed to work as a set, hence pkg upgrade just
> > upgrades everything
> > to the latest version.
> >
>
> Does that mean that, for example, when I upgraded a slew of
> packages ( pkg_add -f ...) that depended upon pkg-config
> but installed and theoretically now depending upon pkgconf, that I'd
> have to do them all by *ports* if using /pkg/ not /var/db/pkg?
> That would seriously hinder fully half of my upgrades, making them
> last a magnitude of hours longer each time...

I'm afraid I haven't a clue what you're talking about. pkgng is nothing to
do with /pkg, and certainly nothing to do with pkg_add.

Chris
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Re: pkgng woes

Jeffrey Bouquet


--- On Fri, 11/9/12, Chris Rees <[hidden email]> wrote:

> From: Chris Rees <[hidden email]>
> Subject: Re: pkgng woes
> To: "Jeffrey Bouquet" <[hidden email]>
> Cc: "FreeBSD Mailing List" <[hidden email]>, "Beeblebrox" <[hidden email]>
> Date: Friday, November 9, 2012, 11:09 AM
> On 9 Nov 2012 18:34, "Jeffrey
> Bouquet" <[hidden email]>
> wrote:
> >
> >
> >
> > --- On Fri, 11/9/12, Chris Rees <[hidden email]>
> wrote:
> >
> > > From: Chris Rees <[hidden email]>
> > > Subject: Re: pkgng woes
> > > To: "Beeblebrox" <[hidden email]>
> > > Cc: [hidden email]
> > > Date: Friday, November 9, 2012, 8:18 AM
> > > On 9 Nov 2012 09:53, "Beeblebrox"
> > > <[hidden email]>
> > > wrote:
> > > >
> > > > Pkgng, as a concept may be great, but it's
> not really
> > > working - at least
> > > for
> > > > me:
> > > >
> > > > 1. pkg2ng conversion does not do a complete
> job and I
> > > have about half of
> > > my
> > > > ports in purgatory or a quasi-installed
> state. The
> > > program runs and is
> > > > installed but pkgdb does not have a record
> for it. So
> > > my ports updates do
> > > a
> > > > half-ass job.
> > > > 2. I am used to portmaster and I accept that
> > > portupgrade is "more ready"
> > > to
> > > > be used with pkgng than portmaster. However,
> portmaster
> > > has the
> > > > "--check-depends" option which I would
> normally use to
> > > correct problem #1,
> > > > alas I see no similar function in portupgrade
> or pkg.
> > > The "portupgrade
> > > -Ffu"
> > > > and "pkg check" commands don't do the trick
> either.
> > > > 3. I have some ports that I never want to
> install (like
> > > accessibility/atk
> > > or
> > > > net/avahi). The new pkgtools.conf has a nice
> feature of
> > > IGNORE_CATEGORIES
> > > > and HOLD_PKGS which I hope will allow me to
> "blacklist"
> > > those ports but I
> > > > have my doubts as the knob is PKGS and not
> PORTS - so
> > > we'll see.
> > > Separately
> > > > though, while trying to get my system pkgng
> complient
> > > and doing updates,
> > > > there have been some ports which were pulled
> in that I
> > > whish to remove. As
> > > > in #2, portmaster --check-depends did a nice
> job of
> > > this and allowed the
> > > > dependency to be removed from the portsdb
> structure -
> > > so same problem here
> > > > as #2.
> > > > 4. I know how to do +IGNOREME in the portsdb
> and that
> > > is a very roundabout
> > > > way of solving an sqlite entry.
> > > > 5. pkg add does not respect existing port
> version
> > > information on the
> > > system.
> > > > If you try to install a package and its
> dependencies,
> > > pkg tries to pull in
> > > > its own preferred version. This happened for
> perl5 - I
> > > have 5.16 already
> > > on
> > > > the system but pkg kept trying to install
> 5.14. The
> > > only solution was to
> > > use
> > > > the old "pkg-add -i" to install one-by-one
> and without
> > > the dependencies.
> > > > Interesting how pkgng does not have the -i
> (no-deps)
> > > option??
> > >
> > > Mixing versions with binary packages is a bad
> idea
> > > anyway.  Packages are
> > > built with a certain set of dependencies, and you
> can't mix
> > > and match (this
> > > has always been the case).  If you want to do
> this, use
> > > ports.  Packages
> > > are designed to work as a set, hence pkg upgrade
> just
> > > upgrades everything
> > > to the latest version.
> > >
> >
> > Does that mean that, for example, when I upgraded a
> slew of
> > packages ( pkg_add -f ...) that depended upon
> pkg-config
> > but installed and theoretically now depending upon
> pkgconf, that I'd
> > have to do them all by *ports* if using /pkg/ not
> /var/db/pkg?
> > That would seriously hinder fully half of my upgrades,
> making them
> > last a magnitude of hours longer each time...
>
> I'm afraid I haven't a clue what you're talking about. pkgng
> is nothing to
> do with /pkg, and certainly nothing to do with pkg_add.
>
> Chris
> _______________________________________________
> [hidden email]
> mailing list
> http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-ports
> To unsubscribe, send any mail to "[hidden email]"
>
Sorry. I was referring to 'you can't mix and match', but I've
always done it more or less. (Here a feature, not a bug... lower
power CPU.s)  I apologize for any confusion, just wanted to
inquire if the "pkg_add  -f" for dependencies, that are not
runtime dependencies, which still allow installing a package;...
Otherwise, in this instance, I'd have to somehow figure out which
of the hundreds of .tbz on a thumbdrive are with pkg-config; which
are with pkgconf; greatly complicating what may be just several
hours to do a slew of upgrades to one CPU.  Admittedly most FreeBSD
users may not face this situation.  Apologies if it is wasting
anyone's time...

J. Bouquet
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Re: pkgng woes

Jeffrey Bouquet
In reply to this post by Bryan Drewery


--- On Fri, 11/9/12, Bryan Drewery <[hidden email]> wrote:

> From: Bryan Drewery <[hidden email]>
> Subject: Re: pkgng woes
> To: "Jeffrey Bouquet" <[hidden email]>
> Cc: [hidden email]
> Date: Friday, November 9, 2012, 10:51 AM
> On 11/9/2012 12:42 PM, Jeffrey
> Bouquet wrote:
> >
> >
> > --- On Fri, 11/9/12, Anton Shterenlikht <[hidden email]>
> wrote:
> >
> >> From: Anton Shterenlikht <[hidden email]>
> >> Subject: Re: pkgng woes
> >> To: [hidden email],
> [hidden email]
> >> Date: Friday, November 9, 2012, 5:22 AM
> >>     @anton
> >>     portmaster --check-depends
> does not work
> >> for me.  Shows everything as fine
> >>     but when I specifically
> target a port: *#
> >> portmaster -i graphics/gimp* for
> >>     example, I get a long list
> of ports to be
> >> installed - meaning not all of the
> >>     existing ports have been
> registered
> >> correctly, hence --check depends will
> >>     not work. Once I re-install
> all of the
> >> "missing depends" and run the same
> >>     command (*# portmaster -i
> graphics/gimp*)
> >> then there are no problems nor
> >>     list of missing depends.
> >>
> >> Well... if it's any consolation, my convertion
> >> to pkgng wasn't easy either. In fact, I'n not
> >> sure I'm all there yet.
> >>
> >> My problem was due to using an outdated portmaster
> pkgng
> >> patch.
> >> Note: this is no longer an issue.
> >> Anyway, I ended up with a corrupted pkg database.
> >> I had to update many ports manually.
> >> Now that the pkg database is fully under pngng
> >> control (I'm just a user and don't follow
> >> the technical details, hence my using of
> non-technical
> >> language) I think portmaster can work with it.
> >> For example portmaster --check-port-dbdir seems
> >> to give correct results.
> >>
> >> Anyway, I think the idea is to remove a lot
> >> of functionality from portmaster and give
> >> it to pkgng. For example checking for missing
> >> dependencies, or shared libs. However, I'm used
> >> to working with ports only, never with packages.
> >> I still don't understand if pkgng is the tool
> >> for me or not. People keep talking of poudriere,
> >> but again I'm not sure if some of the portmaster
> >> functionality is supposed to be taken over
> >> by pourdriere or not.
> >>
> >> Anton
> >> _______________________________________________
> >> [hidden email]
> >> mailing list
> >> http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-ports
> >> To unsubscribe, send any mail to "[hidden email]"
> >>
> > FWIW,
> > The wiki (FreeBSDPackageBuildingComparison) says
> poudriere requires
> > ZSH.  I'd like to write more on this topic but am
> out of time.
>
> ZFS*
>
> It uses base /bin/sh, not zsh.
>
> >
> > J. Bouquet
> > _______________________________________________
> > [hidden email]
> mailing list
> > http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-ports
> > To unsubscribe, send any mail to "[hidden email]"
> >
>
> _______________________________________________
> [hidden email]
> mailing list
> http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-ports
> To unsubscribe, send any mail to "[hidden email]"
>
Sorry for the typo. ( I did not actually mean to zsh-ize the
Zfs... the shell does autocompletion in that regard so I am
not used to differentiate on the typed line, and typed too
hastily.)

J. Bouquet.
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Re: pkgng woes

Beeblebrox
In reply to this post by Bryan Drewery
Bryan Drewery wrote
1. This should not happen if you have the latest portmaster port and use
the PKGNGPATCH option.
2.  It is not required that you use binary packages with pkgng. You can continue using ports with portmaster/portupgrade just fine.
3. Portmaster *is* fully ready for pkgng, and does utilize the pkgng tools
to read from its database.
Q1+Q3. That's not the point: For ports I have compiled + installed AFTER switching to pkgng and AFTER enabling PKGNGPATCH in portmaster, the pkgdb records are populated correctly. The problem is with the ports already installed on the system BEFORE the switch. Most of the records for those ports are corrupt and THERE'S NO WAY TO FIX unless you do a complete rebuild / reinstall after you do a massive sort through everything that is "missing" (from the pkgdb, that is).
Q2. Not with a corrupt / incomplete pkgdb...

Chris Rees-2 wrote
Mixing versions with binary packages is a bad idea anyway.  Packages are
built with a certain set of dependencies, and you can't mix and match.
I only do this when a port build breaks. Say you are building www/foo and build for the depend net/boo breaks or just does not compile. I add net/boo (without any depends) from package and continue with the compile. Or at least I used to be able to do this - Now I no longer can because of pkgng's flag limitations.

@Jeffrey Bouquet:
AFIK, pkg_add will not register the added package on pkgng's pkgdb sqlite database - you must use pkgng's pkg add command for that. You can't even add the same version of a package that was fetched before through the old pkg command through pkgng's pkg add. This is because pkgng packages have mysqldb headers included in the file and pkgng must use those headers in the file to properly register it in the db. Even the file endings are different: .tbz vs .txz.

IN ESSENCE: I have a corrupt pkgdb for pkgng and there are no apparent fix'em tools useable for pkgng. That means I have to re-build everything! Nice...
But too bad that when re-building everything, I no longer have the option of preventing the install of a number of ports listed as dependency but which I absolutely do not want.
P.S. Thanks at least for not asking - "why do you not want that port"? or "what's wrong with it"?
FreeBSD-11-current_amd64_root-on-zfs_RadeonKMS